wait a minute I will be honest terrible is a very strong word to describe my issues with this new video from Cody however I find that many people trust alternate history up for genuine historical information so I decided to use that word as it would ultimately attract more viewers call me dishonest but unfortunately that is the game of YouTube after all but my goal is not to get clicks for this shitty channel rather it is to tell you about the flaws of this video that you and Cody should be aware of of course we're not critiquing the actual alternative scenario because Cody is right there are countless possibilities for alternate history rather we are going to analyze the information and conclusions that are used to create Cody's overall narrative if you are a fan of alternate history hub you now may be asking who is this random asshole shitting on one of my favorite content creators well I will tell you believe it or not I've been a fan of alternate history uh but since the release of his Godzilla video back in 2014 when he had about 12,000 subscribers if I remember correctly wrong I do not want to be a gatekeeper here but I assure you that my experience of alternate history hub is over half a decade long and I am doing this video more so as a service of love than a service of hatred I like Cody's channel but there are many cases where his lack of information or bias damage some genuinely interesting alternate history scenarios and in the case of this newest upload regarding China at least one of these two factors are at play here so without further ado let's get started today China becoming communist seems just like an inevitability but really it was one of the most least likely scenarios that could have happened for decades now in his Red Army were simply a fringe but through guerilla warfare some poor decision-making by their enemies and just dumb good luck now eventually came up on top after the Nationalists launched a purge of thousands of communists war had begun the Communists actually had it pretty bad for the first few years of the war by 1934 they were on the brink of becoming just another footnote in China's long history surrounded by all sides by the Nationalists and their desperation they decided the best move was to retreat and reorganize break through the weakest opening and march 9,000 kilometers north through mountains and warlords to regroup at a better position 90% didn't make it through the year long Trek many dying from crossing a river which led to a change in leadership but it was the maneuver that saved the Red Army and put now on track to becoming a national figure the victory of the Chinese Communists is actually much more likely than you think if you have ever played hearts of iron for then you probably understand the sentiment communists actually made up a huge portion of the left-wing part of the Kuomintang Nationalist Party and the Chinese Communist Party even publicly supported it to say that the Communists were a fringe group for decades is actually quite accurate as they were very integrated with nationalist China for years up until the late 1920s they would again be together in the second United Front but we will talk about that later when Sun yat-sen the first president of the Republic of China died Chiang kai-shek took power he was much like a justo Pinochet of Chile a right-wing authoritarian military dictator who attempted to purge all leftist elements from his party and government he almost immediately betrayed the Communists killing thousands of them in the purge of 12 April over the next year tens of thousands of communists would be killed by the armies of Schank check and his allies despite all of this the Communist Party of China still continued to support the Nationalist Party that is until all communists were forcefully exiled from it in 1927 as a result the Communist Party of China quickly formed a red army in defense and a Chinese civil war began the period between 1927 and 1936 was certainly when the Communists were most vulnerable but they still held their ground against the Nationalists after the devastating long march it seemed as if the Communists were ready for defeat in 1936 but in that same year the Nationalists ended hostilities against the Communists with the creation of the second United Front against Japan this allowed the Communists to gain some breathing space to properly reestablish themselves and assist the Nationalists against the Japanese invasion although they were small compared to the much larger khuman tank forces the Communists displayed tactical and strategic prowess that would become famous among military historians and work such as Mao Zedong's on guerilla warfare since Japan fought primarily against the Nationalists exclusively a nationalist territory the Kuman Tang would be weakened much more than the Communists after the conflict and here we entered the biggest piece of information that kody missed from this part of the video and that is the Soviet Union the Soviets are directly responsible for allowing the Chinese Communists to become a major threat to nationalist China after World War two almost all the territory that the Soviet Union gained in its invasion of Manchuria was given to the Chinese Communists to assist their own efforts against the Nationalists the Soviets also supplied the Chinese with their own equipment and other munitions that were abandoned or captured from the Japanese army combined superior military strategy and tactics with major support from a global superpower and you receive a basic formula for why the Communists ultimately won against the Nationalists even if the Communists were close to defeat again like before the long march it could have simply just retreated into Soviet old territory or gain direct military support from the Soviet Union like how China supported North Korea in the Korean War also if the Communists were close to defeat even after the long march they could have simply retreated into Soviet allied Mongolia Andrey settled in Soviet controlled areas of Manchuria after the Second World War so overall the idea that the Communist victory in China was nearly impossible is inaccurate and now it even go as far as to say dishonest the Nationalists and our timeline handled the Japanese invasion poorly granada' took the industrial might of the United States to ultimately destroy Japan's industrial capabilities but I will add a side note here as well I briefly touched upon the Soviet invasion of Manchuria during the last point but I should emphasize the important role that the USSR played against the Japanese as well after all the United States barely had anything to do with mainland China during World War two so I believe that it is fair to mention the Soviets who actually had a major impact on the Chinese front in Manchuria the Soviet Union easily crushed some of the Japan's best land armies which resulted in a faster territory change than anything seen from the United States during the entire Pacific Theater the Soviet invasion may have even prompted Japan to begin the creation of terms of surrender a masterful piece on foreign policy calm details how it was possible that the Soviets caused the Japanese to surrender not the atomic bombs this article is certainly a very interesting read so I will leave a link to it in the description to see if you so wish and not waste any more time talking about it here even then for the Nationalists the way they conducted themselves didn't paint them in the best light like abandoning Nanking their own capital doing nothing to stop the Japanese from well you know or intentionally flooding one of the most populated regions to stop Japan's advancements going 400 to 500 thousand of their own civilians in the process yeah they weren't perfect or competent even if the Nationalists did win against the Communists they still probably would have done such buffoonish maneuvers during the war which only hurts their own reputation to the general public Cody is right the Kuomintang government was certainly destructive and incompetent but just to further show how destructive commented it was I will show you a relevant video clip from a speech by political scientist and historian dr. Michael Ponte Henry Rosemont he notes that when the Communists liberated Shanghai from the us-sponsored Kuomintang reactionary government in 1949 about the Communists found that about 20% of the population in Shanghai 1.2 million people were drug addicts and every morning special crews of street cleaners quote would gather up the corpses of children and adults who had been murdered during the night or died of disease coal and starvation the Nationalists or cumin tang were not pro-democracy in the beginning under sun yat-sen's guidance yes the original nationalists did wish for an american-style government but these were early days hell the nationalists and communists were even common allies against the imperial system however over time and especially after son's death the nationalist goal became a united china under one party for at least a while and we never actually saw the democracy part till taiwan in the 80s I would say that this analysis is certainly valid however I would add my previous information regarding the transformation of the Nationalists under Shan kai-shek which led to this dresser turned towards more authoritarian and monolithic policies as I also explained previously these policy changes would eventually cause the entire civil war between the Nationalists and the Communists to break out in the first place these are just a couple of important details that I thought would help better picture the situation here even if China was not communist the Korean War probably still would have happened North Korea still would have invaded and the Soviets would have supplied them the difference here however is that the war would be over very quickly the only reason the war ended in a stalemate at all after three years was because the Chinese launched a full-scale invasion pushing back the south if China was to get involved at all it'd be to aid the UN Americans and South Koreans to stop the north and Kim il-sung's reign would end just as soon as it began Korea becoming fully United or maybe China taking a little bit unfortunately this is probably alternate history hubs biggest brass moment in the entire video in the context of kody scenario Korea would actually end up becoming fully united under the communist government now why is this well it comes down to a key fact that I am surprised to see overlooked in the creation of Kodi's alternate scenario you see the military coalition led by the United States was approved by the United Nations Security Council and any single member of the Security Council can veto any resolution the Soviet Union was a permanent member of this council and it directly supported North Korea so why did the Soviets not vetoed the entire United States backed counter invasion well it is because the USSR was boycotting the Security Council over its refusal to recognize communist China as the proper Chinese government I will let this article from history calm explain the rest in late June 1950 it became apparent that the Soviet action had backfired when the issue of North Korea's invasion of South Korea was brought before the Security Council by June 27th the Security Council voted to invoke military action by the United Nations for the first time in the organization's history the Soviets could have blocked the action in the Security Council since the United States Soviet Union China Britain and France each had absolute veto power but no Russian delegate was present in just a short time a multinational UN force arrived in South Korea and the growing three-year Korean War was underway so if China ever became communist then the Soviet Union would have never boycotted the United Nations Security Council and as a result the Security Council would have never allowed the US and its allies to enter the war against North Korea ultimately North Korea would have been able to win against the south and unite the peninsula overall in cody's alternate scenario the Korean Peninsula would be undivided and fully read now we have reached the halfway point in analyzing this video normally I would continue until the very end but I realize that this response would be way too long for a single video so in the interest of a more frequent upload schedule I am splitting this response up into two parts don't worry the next half should be released by next week overall I hope you all enjoyed this response so far I can guarantee that shorter uploads are coming soon and if you are new to my content then please consider supporting this channel however you wish thank you all very much for watching and I hope to see you soon

Author Since: Mar 11, 2019

  1. I like Cody but sometimes he makes a few mistakes in some of his videos and a lot of mistakes in this one

  2. Ironic is that the Soviet Union almost doomed communism in China by ordering the Communists to work with the KMT.

  3. Wouldn't the West, possibly with Nationalist Chinese support, ignore the UN and prop up South Korea anyway?

  4. I appreciate the style of editing you did with your avatar. However the hoi4 reference doesn’t hit as well as you think.

  5. Just some extra notes to add;

    1) Sun Yat-Sen did not want a US-style "democracy". He applauded Lenin and desired what now Americans would consider "Socialism" (but by material standards, social democracy). This isn't a surprise because the Entente screwed China over during WW1 by ceding German colonies in China (such as Qingdao) to the Japanese Empire. So in other words, it's our fault we got Sun Yat-Sen to begin improving relations with the Bolsheviks of Russia.

    2) Democracy in China by the 1980s? This is a bit of a joke. The Soviet Republic of China was formed in reaction to the KMT purging basically anyone who sympathised with basic worker's democracy, from moderate-left to Marxist-left. As a consequence, Chinese Soviets were formed whereby democratic delegations would be performed and participated by the people until the capitalist restoration when this was not possible due to the separation of economy from government (thus, replacing common ownership and workplace democracy with private hierarchy).

    Just some extra info, but you did good nonetheless!

  6. Thanks for doing this. I also have liked alternate history hub for a while, even before I became a red. But when I did, I noticed a few small things. Some historical mistakes and flops whenever it came to talking about soviets or anything communist in nature. He isn't wilfully dishonest, just a bit missinformed on those topics, which can be expected from most Americans. It takes a bit to tear through the red white and blue veil of american education. Hell I still remember how they taught us more about the holodomor then the actual holocaust, and how they worded the holodomor to be a WORSE genocide. I hope Alternate History Hub sees this and either corrects his video or responds in a meaningful way.

  7. oh yes another thing Cody missed, the xinjiang territory wanted to join the USSR. just when the negotiations between uyghurs and russians were supposed to start, the uyghur president died in a plane crash(most likely staged)stalin wanted to appease Mao by giving him xinjiang and manchuria. i am beggining to think that without mao, the russians would just move in and annex all of china.funnily enough this would have been better off for the chinese. They would have industrialized faster and there wouldnt have been 30 million dead chinese due to a famine induced by killing millions of sparrows.

  8. Xinjiang was also occupied by the Soviet Union and later returned to the Chinese communist party, there would be an independent or Soviet Xinjiang in case for a Kuomintang victory

  9. Great video! I just have a little problem with the guy claiming that before the communists came everyone in the city was addicted to drugs and starving. I don't know if it's true, but to me it sounds so over the top that I have my doubts about it.

  10. another thing to note is that the DPRK was swamping the ROK up until the UN forces arrived

  11. I looked up the claim that the USSR boycotted the UN security council decision on NK and it seemed it was because the proposal to expel the nationalist Chinese representative (not communist) failed. I fully admit I didn't know about this beforehand so I might not have a full picture.

  12. Great, finally another thing I can put in the 'stuff Uncle Joe did wrong' section of my memory:
    1) Re-criminalizing homosexuality
    2) Not aiding the Spanish Republicans and/or PCE enough (debatable if that would even be worth it tho)
    3) Boycotting the security council; like c'mon even if they didn't lose out on protecting the DPRK, they might still lose out on other important stuff, that just seems plain out stupid to me.

    Tbh, if they wanted to protest, couldn't they just veto the shit out of the council, basically putting in gridlock?

  13. Wow, the Soviets boycotting the UN secrurity council turned out to be one of their major oofs, which lead to millions of deaths. I'm not saying it's their fault obviously. It's the reactionary's of course, because they invaded.

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